Jack Sharry: Hello, WealthTech on Deck listeners. Thank you for joining us on this special edition of our podcast. Today’s show will be unique. Each week we talk with industry executives about their strategy regarding the future of wealth management. They often share their processes of how they’re building their platform or their discrete capabilities as they bring the various elements together what I call the confluence of digital and human advice. Today we will talk with someone who hasn’t just strategized about it, although she’s done plenty of that, but it’s actually built an industry first UMH capability very pleased to have Rose Palazzo who has been the Managing Director and Head of Financial Planning at Morgan Stanley for many years. It was just announced the other day that she is now the group head of money guy Pro. So I’m sure you’re reading about that in the news as we record this podcast too. But before Rose moved on from Morgan Stanley, Rose led the build of a groundbreaking capability around retirement income generation. In fact, what she in the Morgan Stanley team built was a first of its kind, she will describe it in more detail. But intelligent portfolio withdrawals is the industry’s first multi account income generation capability. IPT, as it’s known, suggests the optimal sequence of withdrawals from multiple accounts and holdings Rose, my friend, great to have you back on WealthTech on Deck. Thanks for joining us.

Rose Palazzo: Thanks so much, Jack. It’s great to be here.

Jack Sharry: Now joining me for this discussion is my colleague and friend, Steve Zuschin. Steve and I work closely together. He’s a LifeYield colleague, Steve and many others here at LifeYield. worked closely with Rose, the Morgan Stanley team for many years to build this capability. In fact, it’s at least six years of in the making, Rose, Steve will discuss so I’ll join him from time to time, but they’ll discuss how building this kind of complex capability requires teamwork with Morgan Stanley has many departments that were involved in touch this and the many outside software providers, like LifeYield. So it’s been a real group effort. They’ll talk about that, and really the power of partnership. So we will have a conversation of what it takes to partner and build a complex ecosystem that breaks new ground and provides improved outcomes for all investors, advisors and firms. So Rose, why don’t we start with one you describe intelligent portfolio withdrawals, what is it

Rose Palazzo:  Absolutely. So I’m going to actually start with the broader sort of view of what we were trying to do at the time. And that was really to provide comprehensive advice to clients help our advisors do so. But to do that in a way that both enhanced advice, as well as the client experience and the financial advisor experience, what a really important component that is number one, starting with a client’s personal objectives, sort of their personal goals, making sure that’s integrated with the process and leading sort of the advice that we’re providing. And another piece of that is being able to execute on it. So enhancing the advice and executing on the advice that the advisors were providing. Were two of the objectives that IPW intelligent portfolio withdrawals really spoke to. One is comprehensive advice means that we looked across the portfolio, we understood what client’s goals are, and what the what that wealth was trying to achieve. And in order to do that, or to provide the advice, we needed analytics and an engine that helped make it more efficient, we’re talking about things with just the number of securities or products and accounts could be incredibly time consuming for advisors and something that they couldn’t provide in scale. And to being able to execute that easily. Once they generated that advice, meaning complete integration and connectivity to execution platforms was sort of the other piece and intelligent portfolio withdrawals hit on both of those. That last objective that I talked about, in terms of enhancing the experience for clients and advisors, was really about how we chose to execute. So we leveraged a vendor platform in the background through LifeYield, we found a fantastic partner that could work with us in a way that let us control some of the pieces and then really leveraged where their expertise were. So that that really fit on the objective of enhancing the experience for folks.

Jack Sharry: So Rose, my mistake, we’re so intimately familiar with all that you’ve built, we’ve kind of stepped over a big thing that we built in the first place together. And that is the whole notion of the financial planning tool that you and your team built. The role that live he’ll played in terms of the asset location and the importance of that, and how that wound up in your proposal system. If you sort of take us through that because that’s what It was a lead into intelligent portfolio withdrawals. So I kind of stepped over that if you’d maybe catch us back up on maybe the preceding work and how important that was and how that all worked out.

Rose Palazzo: Yeah, absolutely. That was another big step in the process. So if we’re, if our objective was to provide comprehensive advice to clients that really put at the center, the client’s personal objectives, we wanted to leverage financial planning for that. And what we had found in the past was not that we didn’t have planning capabilities, or advisors weren’t delivering planning to clients, but that it was disconnected from the rest of the process. So what would happen is a plan that created deliver to a client. But when you attempted to execute that advice across multiple accounts, and accounts, or a portfolio where you may not manage everything, there was really a hurdle and a gap there, both from an experience perspective, as well as just being able to keep aligned to the plan that people created. So one of the first things that we did was to integrate the plan with our investment advice and investment proposal tool. And we leveraged life yields, asset location capabilities to help with that, and why we were incredibly excited about that, is one, it addressed the execution issue that we had, when you start with a plan and multiple accounts, and you’re generating portfolio advice. And now you’re looking at execution. And you have to make that happen across multiple accounts. That can be a lot of levers for an individual to attempt to churn. And so being able to sort of click button, get advice at an account level that rolled up to that portfolio level advice that can be easily executed, was an objective. And as I mentioned, we were equally excited about it, because we are adding value to clients, right, just by executing in a smarter way, being tax efficient about how we did that upfront. And that was the beginning of the work, right? We started with his clients objectives, we said how do we get that executed? And that integration and being able to tell clients with value was really important to us. And that actually led to the next step. So now when we’re attempting to generate income from those portfolios, how do we do that, and the smartest way possible, and the most efficient way possible. So you can see kind of that journey. And because it’s so complex and requires a lot of integration, we took it in pieces. So Jack, thank you for bringing up that sort of first step of executing the advice on that implementation process.

Jack Sharry: So thanks, Rose. That’s great. Steve, I know you have some perspective on this, you know how to connect the dots on on this stuff. That’s that’s the biggest challenge, right coordination of how to make that work when accumulation from from the plan that helps set up accumulation, which has a lot to do with keeping tax and cost in mind and risk, and then ultimately playing it out in terms of retirement income, what are you if you could provide the sort of the your perspective, because you’ve been close on this? Not only with Morgan Stanley, but many of our other clients?

Steve Zuschin: Yeah, thanks, Jack, you know, row sets a lot of interesting parts there. And I think that the main thing that I zoned in on is that they had an objective, and they knew the order of these objectives. And the first thing was to make the advice and a proposal implementable. And, you know, I think one of the one of the strengths of LifeYield is that we’ve always focused on partnerships where we can really help enhance a proprietary experience. And I think for a lot of the audience is probably listening, Jack, the term integration is kind of vanilla, right? It’s a little bit whitewashed. And this term integration can mean 1000 different things. And I think what a lot of people have gotten used to is really lackluster experience of I get passed from one platform to another to do something that’s maybe only one way, right. And now I’m left with this experience where data was shared, that maybe got me to an answer I couldn’t have done otherwise. But now I don’t really know what to do with it. And so I love and I’d like to hear more about how Rose got to that point of really understanding how to leverage a partner to enhance that proprietary offering that she was building at Morgan Stanley. Rose, do you want to dig into that a little more?

Rose Palazzo: I think I mentioned that one of our objectives was improving the advisor and the client experience. And there’s a couple of reasons. The advisor experience is actually one of the things that promotes adoption of these tools. And in the past, even personally, we use the term integration to mean passing of data, right? So you didn’t have to log into another tool or reenter data. And that was sort of the definition of, of integration. And we really focus on something else, which is making sure that the workflow is one that supported and advisors experience in a way that made the process not something that was too cumbersome. And that made sense. And that sort of across the experience. Dan’s not just going one way, but kind of going back and going back and forth. But things were connected and coordinated. And so you weren’t being passed off into a different part of the platform, and having to learn different usage patterns and getting caught up on maybe different terminology and things like that, which add a lot to efficiency for people, right, we get used to a certain pattern, things are easier to get through. And what you can focus on is where you’re adding value, versus kind of getting over the hurdles of the platform. So we definitely took a stance, that experience was really important. Equally as important for clients, meaning everything had to feel like it came from the same place for a client that we were using the same terminology across the reports and the experience that the client got, right so that they didn’t have to learn a different term, or learn a different graph, or like those types of things. So we tried to find a vendor that could partner with us in that way where we owned experience, we drove some of that we’ve leveraged them for their experience and intellectual capital in that space. But we actually really partnered on driving with it, what that experience ends up being, and the partnership is one where I know throughout the process, we would share with each other, right. So while we didn’t want to leverage somebody else’s user experience, we learned a great deal from that experience, and two pieces of it that were really helpful to our own. And then we would share what our experience was just so that we could get the feedback and some of the expertise that LifeYield had to provide.

Steve Zuschin: I’ll push on that a little bit more. Because, you know, we talk to a lot of firms, we have a lot of different clients that kind of spread the the spectrum of the financial services industry, and you know, the opinion around partnership, outsourcing, integrating with third parties, it’s kind of all over the map. And so I’m curious, because I know, it wasn’t just like, You guys didn’t jump right into this decision of okay, well, we’re going to outsource these capabilities to a third party, I’m sure that there was some push and pull even among your own team around whether or not you could build these capabilities or whether or not you should outsource them. Before you even got into partnering with LifeYield. How did that go?

Rose Palazzo: We definitely did a lot of evaluation, right. And I think for all of the sort of buy versus build decisions, there is a fair amount of evaluation that goes into that. I also think there’s a lot of personal experience that people bring to that decision. So if you think about, I may have had past experiences where I integrated, so maybe there was a problem with the experience. And I’m going to I want to completely go in the other direction. Really, at some point, you have to kind of wipe all of that away and think about what are the objectives that you have. So I know I’ve mentioned them a couple of times, client advisor experience, enhancing the advice, integrating and coordinating everything for those objectives. And so we share those with the partners that we were evaluating, and sort of evaluated their receptivity to give and take and sharing and push and pull and understanding that we had some objectives and personal thoughts around what needed to be executed. And so I think in that evaluation, just evaluating receptivity to that type of partnership is really important. The second thing that I think personally I looked at was that sometimes when people evaluate that decision, they’re thinking about, well, could we do this on our own? And for me, you don’t necessarily have to do everything that you could do, right? Like, could we do all the pieces on our own? Absolutely. But what do we lose from that we lose some of the experience and the expertise, and the the broader experience, right, like somebody else can bring to the table. So it’s not a pure monetary or capability decision point, either. It’s sort of the, what does partnership bring to this that could add more than I could do on my own? So I would say those are some of the things that we kept front of mind. It’s more than just the technology, right? In order to get these platforms to be used by advisors and by clients. It is about communication and training. And how do we explain this to clients in a way that’s consumable in a way that they understand the value? And so you can evaluate potential partnerships just based on the technology that they bring to the table, their capacity to engage in a partnership, but also that expertise that I talked about goes beyond the technology, what hurdles Did you hit on when you tried to get people to use this to clients understand it when you put it in front of them? And that was a big piece of what we got from that partnership is as well and especially being new with that can going in. Right. So that was the first time we launched it, and did not necessarily have that experience. Now, could we have gotten there? Yes. But I believe that but I do think what LifeYield brought to the table in terms of being able to very quickly have advisors understand the benefit, have advisors be able to share that benefit with clients, was tremendous, right and responsible for some of the early success that we had.

Jack Sharry: So Steve, one of the things you have, as part of your experiences that you’ve worked with RA firms for a very long time, you were one of the earlier employees at Hidden levers, you know, Ras as well as anybody as far as I’m concerned. So you really understand their mindset and how they work and how they operate, and so on. And then at LifeYield do built up, we signed up something like 400 RIA firms to work with LifeYield. So you understand the RIA what they’re looking for. And the RiA is a very independent adviser and just trying to figure out how to do this stuff. And a lot of times has to figure it out how to do it on their own. Talk a little bit about sort of what you bring to the table and what you’ve learned our relationship with Morgan Stanley, to our colleagues that has worked closely with Morgan Stanley brings something different. You have that advisor perspective of what they want and need and the importance of the quantification. I know as part of it, there’s more than that. But talk if you would a little bit about what Rose was just referring to about how important it is that sort of those intangibles about that experience with other clients and other situations. So that ultimately what happens is, you can inform as Morgan Stanley is going to build this capability and inform them to build a better mousetrap, if you will, based on the kind of experience that Rosa has been describing, I know you, you have so much of.

Steve Zuschin: You know, I think it starts at a with a partnership, like we’ve been able to build with Rose’s team at Morgan Stanley as well as other teams, it creates this force multiplier, where it’s really like, I feel like the most true and honest definition of a knowledge base. You know, one of the things that I learned early on in my career is that we’ve entered a new era of being open and sharing our knowledge where there was maybe a previous area where the value of a member of a team or an employee was what they kind of held hostage, and it was their secret sauce to how to solve problems, right. And now we’re in this new era, where you know, the value is how open how willing are you to share that knowledge and, and really encourage and help others kind of know what you know, and let that go out and spread across an organization. And something we talked about earlier, you know, that I didn’t get to comment on is really this through a partnership, that collaboration, I think is where that blossoms a lot of the time you think of licensing or outsourcing a capability from an engineering perspective is really this sterile, like we’re going to access this algorithm to do this math, and it becomes this kind of sterile exchange. And I think that that’s where buy versus build is like we can build the algorithm, right? Like we can do that. But what we don’t get is the insights of all all the bumps and bruises that were occurred on along the way of building and marketing those solutions that rose just commented on. So one of the things that we learned in house and that I brought to the table is that we need to answer the why. So no matter how smart the math is, and no matter how better off an investor may be if they are to group their accounts, and to follow a coordinated approach to investing their assets. It comes down to how do we answer the why, you know, in my experiences across our industry, we’re inundated with information. So I need to be able to serve up that why right away. And so what we developed is some scoring methodology within LifeYield to really help boil down like, Is there value and going further on this conversation, whether it’s coordinating accounts to improve asset location, how you’re going to file for Social Security, how you’re going to draw your assets down and accumulate them during retirement, all of that we’ve developed our own way of answering that, why right away. And all of those RIAs that we got to work with early on in my career in my journey here at LifeYield. We got that feedback so quick, right? And they helped us really fine tune that messaging around what’s important, what’s important to them, what’s important to their client, how do you motivate those next steps because a lot of the time, clients are kind of left with like, Hey, man, you talk to me about my R squared and volatility and this investment strategy and that investment strategy. And by the way, my probability of success, my plan is decent, I trust you. And this really requires that collaboration between the advisor and their client. How do we help foster that so that they can follow the guidance that we offer?

Jack Sharry: So Rose, we’ve we’ve talked about the plan that you built GPS goals planning system talked about the asset, location capability, that light field and we can certainly worked on together to quantify the benefit of improved outcome during accumulation around asset location. We’ve mentioned intelligent portfolio withdrawals, and there’s some stuff in between we probably won’t get to too on today’s podcast, but what gets done around The ongoing management, if you’d like to address that, that’s fine. But want to get to the sort of the heart of the matter in terms of the recent development at Morgan Stanley, that’s called intelligent portfolio withdrawals? Why don’t you just tell our audience? What is it? Why does it matter. And also, if you would, and I know you know this better than anyone, this stuff’s pretty complicated and complex to pull off. We’ve talked a little bit about that, and how you guys overcame that, that level of complexity.

Rose Palazzo: So intelligent portfolio withdrawals, as a, as a component of the broader platform that I talked about, is really about helping clients and advisors generate the income that they need from their portfolio. So we’re talking about multiple accounts, looking across holdings at attack at a tax audit level, and helping to efficiently make decisions about what to liquidate in order to generate what they need, and take into account all of the different platforms and products that we have available. So one of the things that made what we did so complex, was that we didn’t limit what was in the portfolio. So this was open architecture, if advisors were choosing to manage through different advisory platforms or brokerage platforms, were really saying everything could be included. And so the complexity there was pretty incredible. And part of it is around, as I mentioned, the enhanced advice. So let’s take into account things like RMDs that might be expected in the liquidation order of things, and then actually getting down to the transactional, which should be sell. And that’s a combination of rules around what you should do. And then in acknowledgement and integration with what the platforms were that we were integrating with. So what’s possible in a platform? And how do we accommodate that in the vise that we’re providing to clients? And how do we integrate with that so that you can click a button and execute and make that as efficient as possible. So that integration across all those platforms and products accounts, was complex and requires a lot of sort of evaluation and analysis, and then in the details, and a great amount of partnership with life yields, right. So that in terms of saying, Here’s how advisors are managing things here, or here’s how certain platforms work here, we need to accommodate that. There was a partnership where we could make enhancements or changes to be able to execute on that.

Steve Zuschin: That’s so awesome. Jack, I’m going to just interject real quick because I think one of the key things I heard is that you didn’t limit the investment solutions or the products available on the platform. And you know, I’ll name an unnamed juggernaut in the industry had marketed a solution that is a coordinated withdrawal. And when it first came out, I was like, thrilled, I’m like, Oh, my God, they’re taking this to the everyday person. And then through a little bit, I didn’t need to go that deep to figure out that to participate in that platform, you had to also be invested into a very narrow set of investments, which, you know, the way that the industry has evolved and investors in at will have involved is, now that these things are becoming available, the story sounds really great. But they’re bringing a lot of baggage, right, they have a backpack full of investments that they’ve made along their career that they can’t just liquidate. So in order to get into the investment products, that’s a hurdle that very few people can overcome. So I love the fact that you guys kept your eye on that ball, and that we could help overcome that issue of whatever you have, on any platform, we can work with it

Rose Palazzo: and see that that points to the conversation we had earlier just around how important the communication to advisors and clients is because it’s difficult for clients, I think not all clients. But if you’re hearing sort of the story through a marketing message, what is the difference between these two things if we’re all saying, Hey, we liquidate in a regenerate income in a tax efficient way? And so how do we in a concise, easily consumable way, let clients know that it’s more open architecture, it doesn’t limit what you can invest in. It isn’t a product on its own. It’s a solution that allows you to invest the way that you want. But the communication of that has to be a focus. Otherwise, you could get confused that sort of other products that are limiting are doing the same thing for you.

Jack Sharry: So let me let me take this up a level for for our audience. So I’m sure it’s following exactly what it said because it’s being said so well, but I want to underscore what both these folks are talking about both Rosen’s and Steve, and that is that there have been a number of attempts over time to come up with easy solutions around how to grow Your assets more efficiently and how to draw them down. Who would want that? The challenge is that the typical household has multiple accounts, multiple custodians, multiple advisors, multiple products, multiple holdings, none of which are coordinated or, and if they are, they’re coordinated with a particular advisor at a particular custodian. But they’re not coordinated in the aggregate. That’s really this really rare this concept of the Unified manage household which I should underscore, that’s a destination. That’s where the industry is going. We’re on the road there. And clearly what Rose and her team and colleagues at Morgan Stanley built is a huge leap forward. But back to some of the folks that talk about this as a concept or as a marketing approach. There’s a lot of that going on has been for a long time, all well intentioned, but the hard work of doing what Rose is describing as it can’t be understated, it’s it’s hard. It’s very complex. When accounts are spread all over. holdings are spread all over s and allocations don’t make sense. Investments are in the wrong account type. So you have high yield bonds and taxable accounts that have muni bonds and tax free accounts, you can’t do that. And we see that unfortunately, sadly, it happens when we see the see the data. Point being as people don’t don’t really have an overarching way and approach. It really what intelligent portfolio withdrawals is done, it brings it together, where when you look at it in the aggregate, it suggests the optimal sequence of withdrawal, mindful of both risk and tax because Morgan Stanley works closely integrated into their, their platform is Blackrock selected for risk. Life yields, tech smarts, and that combination of risk and smarts in my view, the two sides of the same coin, which if you’re going to make a risk move, you got to consider the tax consequence. As you pull that together. Essentially, it’s all in line with the idea of how do I improve outcome? Oh, by the way that’s been ordered. And unless we step over it, and not underscore it sufficiently, that because of all these holdings being all over the place, you really got to look at it in the aggregate and then make recommendations as the platform that’s been developed between LifeYield and Morgan Stanley, by looking in the aggregate, we really are suggesting the optimal way to accumulate assets and to make a withdrawal. So Rose, that was a ton. Did I get it? Right?

Rose Palazzo: Did you absolutely did.

Jack Sharry: Steve, anything to add to that?

Steve Zuschin: Well, I mean, I would just ask Rose, maybe. We’ve We’ve talked a lot we talk a lot about this concept of the UMH withdrawals as part of it and implementable proposal is another part. But one question I get from a lot of the firms we talk about our talk with and partner with is where do we start? And my answer is always well, what’s the most important part to solve for you right now? And you obviously chose the proposal and withdrawals, do you see that work kind of ballooning out into the other arms have the organization to be able to help coordination across those accounts, regardless of the action of the client and the relationship with the advisor and the client?

Rose Palazzo: I do. I mean, I think that evaluation of where to start is an important one, because what we’re talking about is the entire wealth management process across an entire the client’s entire wealth, right. So that’s enormous body of work. And there are a lot of places that you can choose to start. And I think your point around and your advice to folks is the is key, right? It’s looking at where the gap is for you now, and what’s the most important element that will bring the most value. And that’s a good place to start. So if you’ve got great usage of planning, and it’s an easy sort of connectivity to your investment proposal, but you really don’t have anything to help clients, liquidate that might be the place to start and then continue to improve along along the way. But I do think the different relationships that we have with different advisors, so we’ve got branch advisors, advisors and call centers, we’ve got direct clients who have to think about these capabilities for all of those relationships. We started in one place where I was previously. But that didn’t mean that that’s where we were going to stop, right. And I do think for investors, taking a coordinated view of their wealth is becoming more and more critically important. They’re understanding that all of your wealth is connected. And the two things, one, coordinating it, and executing in the smartest way possible, is just going to add a tremendous amount of value and ensure that their personal objectives are able to be met, or that they have the most options possible, right when they get to that point of needing to make a decision.

Steve Zuschin: So Rose, this conversation has been great, and we really appreciate the time and I’ve learned a lot and one question I have that I’m curious about is you You’ve done a lot. You’ve accomplished so much at Morgan Stanley. And now you’re taking this new opportunity and jumping into a new position with a new company. And I just really am curious to know what you’re excited about with this new with this new role.

Rose Palazzo: Yeah, so I’m, I’m excited about a lot. I mean, first, I’m incredibly excited about the new role that I’m taking on being part of the money guy team. If you think about that, that firm, they’re an industry leader in financial planning, and delivering capabilities to advisors and clients around that I’ve worked closely with Tony Leal, the president of MoneyGuide for over 13 years. And I think they’re another firm that is truly a partner to their clients, I’ve had an opportunity to partner with him and his team, we’ve co developed with bated things. And really, together, we’re able to deliver some innovative capabilities, right, that’s in their tool today. And I’m excited about what this means for the future and being able to work with them. One other thing that really made me excited about this next role, was talking to Bill Crager. And seeing his passion about delivering on an intelligent financial life for investors. And it’s his passion. And I think the passion of everybody at investment, to deliver on that and to put together sort of the pieces in that ecosystem that they have to be able to make that happen. And that goes to really what it means for clients and for advisors and some of the things that we talked about Steve, which is now we’re at this interesting point, where personal financial advice really centered on a client’s personal goals and financial objectives is more of a focus for investors and for advisors, people have a better understanding that advice needs to be comprehensive, or at least take into account a client’s comprehensive financial picture. And that all of the components of a client’s well should be coordinated. And so that really takes that type of ecosystem that we’re talking about. Technology is at a point where it can support that complexity and scale. So I’m just excited what the role has in store what we’re going to be able to deliver and what that means for clients.

Jack Sharry: Rose, I’m really excited for you and what you’re embarking on and invest that. And I’ve been following closely Bill Crager and I have known each other for a really long time. In this industry, I’ve known Tony a long time, I think what Bill’s has been putting in continues to put together in terms of the talent capabilities, there’s a real movement afoot that I find most impressive. And now with you coming on board with all that you’ve accomplished to date with much more to go, it seems to me like invest that has just about every capability you can imagine. And that it seems to me that MoneyGuide is a centerpiece of that. And it’s also seems to me that it will all flow through money, I do want to talk about that a little bit. It’s pretty exciting. What you have before you money guide seems to be at least from my perspective, a Cornerstone element of a very expansive and very robust set of offerings.

Rose Palazzo: I think that’s a great way to describe it as a cornerstone, I think they have an incredibly robust ecosystem of products and technology and solutions. I think it goes back to when we talk about planning and money guide, it goes back to putting the client at the center. And planning is that place where you get a really good understanding of what a client’s personal objectives are. Or you can vet advice and see impact long term. And so it really does become the cornerstone of these discussions and some of what we we talked about earlier around the concept of your major or managing clients wealth in a coordinated way. So I think calling that the cornerstone makes a ton of sense as it really does put the client at the center of it.

Jack Sharry: So whether observations as we’ve worked closely with you and your colleagues at Morgan Stanley for so long, we’ve all come to realize that you can’t do a UMH unified managed household without starting with a plan that maybe you don’t start with the plan. Actually, you start with data and a bunch of other things. But however you pull the data together, it resides in the plan. And from there, you determine how to go forward. But a plan without implementation is just a plan. And my sense is based on what you’ve done in the past and where you’re going. Really the focus will be around how to implement the plan, how to make it real. Do you want to comment about that?

Rose Palazzo: That idea that as an industry, I think, as a digital firms, advisors have been delivering planning, but the problem that we had, I think in the past is that it was disconnected from execution. And it was revisited less often than a plan probably should be I think more traditionally, not to say that that’s the case across the board. But I think as a whole sometimes the plan was completed and you sort of walked away from it and the type of integration that’s required an interview ration like we were talking about earlier, that’s required in order to make that happen, I think was really the hurdle that separated sort of having the planning conversation from the execution is sort of what’s the type of integration? How can we make it easier for folks to do that? I think the advice becomes more enhanced when you’re connecting it to integration, right? So you really are getting more specifics. And you’re getting to aligning advisors more closely to what clients objectives are. And then I think when you start to integrate with execution, the way that we determine whether or not you stick to a strategy, or whether a change needs to be made, or how you avoid pitfalls, all of those things become easier as well. So integration of planning to execution and to progress reporting is just a big component of this. Absolutely.

Jack Sharry: Yeah, if I could underscore what you just said, and frankly, where we started, what you and your colleagues built at Morgan Stanley is the first and only multi account optimized intelligent withdrawal process that exists in the industry. And as you will know, because you spent many years working at this is not easy stuff, but you figured it out, and you made it real. So I look forward to what you might pull off at investment I think invest net, its advisors and customers are going to be really benefit from the fact that you’re the first and only that I know of that’s actually pulled this off. So I wish you nothing but the best is as you move forward,

Rose Palazzo: Thank you so much. To both of you, thank you for the partnership. It made what we did possible, really it was just a team effort.

Jack Sharry: Truly, truly. So if I may turn to our audience for a moment. One last time if you’ve enjoyed our podcast, please rate review and subscribe or share what we’re doing here WealthTech on Deck we are available wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you again Rose this has been a lot of fun learned a lot as always, and and once again enlightened. So very much appreciate the time and the opportunity to chat so we look forward to the next time.